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Post by lee on Nov 10, 2023 18:57:58 GMT
In Lady Jane's comic appearances, and the story Willows and Hexes, we are given the impression she speaks rather haltingly. When she speaks..., she does so... with frequent...pauses. I was wondering if I should keep this particular speech pattern, or should I drop it after it is inferred?
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Post by dans on Nov 10, 2023 19:35:33 GMT
I believe if you are going to show it using ellipses as you did above, you should only do it once or twice, and then occasionally note it... "... as was her habit, she spoke slowly, with frequent pauses..."
it gets really old, really fast, seeing those pauses all the time.
Once when I was attempting to write 'British' I did some research on this, and one of the items of advice was to do it once or twice in the beginning and then use 'normal' speech patterns and remind people occasionally of the accent. I don't know how well this actually works, but it's what I do now most of the time.
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Post by DocQuantum on Nov 10, 2023 21:33:30 GMT
That’s how Swamp Thing speaks, so it’s not just an affectation, but a speech impediment.
It’s how most if not all wood elementals are depicted as speaking. Lady Jane is one of them.
My suggestion is to write her dialogue normally and then add in the ellipses afterwards. That’s how I wrote Swamp Thing’s speech in each of the stories I’ve featured him in.
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Post by redsycorax on Nov 12, 2023 21:45:28 GMT
As a matter of interest, could this be tied into this Mark Merlin story somehow?: www.arche-arc.blogspot.com/2017/04/mythcomics-threat-of-horrible-hex-house.htmlIt seems Mark Merlin faced off against three seventeenth century darkmages in New England in "Threat of the Horrible Hex" House of Secrets 64 (January-February 1964). These involved Spinster Toten (a witch), Black Moon (a Native American medicine man) and Peter Stalb, who has learnt African and Asian darkmagic, including voudoun. The synopsis for the story is this: Merlin and his companions, Elsa and his feline familiar Memakata, travel to Halzburg, Pennsylvania, a Pennsylvania Dutch settlement whose inhabitants belonged to the Dubenite sect (akin to the Amish). Elsa spies a hex sign on a local barn and Merlin relates the events of 1690, when one of the town founders, Mayor Josef Von Helz, encountered a three-way satanic pact between Spinster Toten, Black Moon and Peter Stalb. He defeats them, but then notes three indelible hex symbols for each darkmage are etched on his barn. Unable to break the curse, as well as destroying the town in the process, it develops that each successive generation of the Von Halz family has vanished on their twenty fifth birthday. Henrietta Von Halz, Josef's latest descendant, isn't keen on following them and asks Merlin and his companions for their supernatural help. Merlin takes the curse onto himself and the three darkmages attack- Black Moon unleashes hurricane winds, Spinster Toten causes a crack in the earth to appear, which Merlin levitates out of, and Stalb uses a voodoo doll to paralyse Merlin's limbs. However, Merlin has noticed the barn's three hex symbols heat up just before the darkmages attack, and that there is a fourth hex symbol. Merlin works out that the fourth symbol was etched by Josef Von Halz to provide a countersign to the darkmages, which he activates, imprisoning them once more: Source: leagueofcomicgeeks.com/comic/9033182/house-of-secrets-64One wonders if these three necromancers ever got out of their imprisonment afterward...?
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Post by lee on Nov 13, 2023 15:08:14 GMT
Sounds very interesting. I will have to check that story out. Thanks for bringing it to my attention.
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Post by redsycorax on Nov 14, 2023 3:25:06 GMT
As for Lady Jane, perhaps she was (a) born with cerebral palsy (b) has difficulties forming human words due to her wooden form and dissimilar morphology (c) is not from an anglophone society originally and had to learn English as a second language, so she's hesitant about whether she's got the correct vocabulary, pronunciation or grammar when she speaks* (*which would tie in nicely if you wanted to develop the Mark Merlin/Halzburg angle within your story- what if she's of German derivation herself?)
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Post by dans on Nov 14, 2023 13:50:27 GMT
I think the "has difficulties forming human words due to her wooden form and dissimilar morphology" is the explanation Doc was suggesting, as a generic for all similar elementals....
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Post by lee on Nov 14, 2023 15:09:17 GMT
As for Lady Jane, perhaps she was (a) born with cerebral palsy (b) has difficulties forming human words due to her wooden form and dissimilar morphology (c) is not from an anglophone society originally and had to learn English as a second language, so she's hesitant about whether she's got the correct vocabulary, pronunciation or grammar when she speaks* (*which would tie in nicely if you wanted to develop the Mark Merlin/Halzburg angle within your story- what if she's of German derivation herself?) She is English. Apparently, most of the manifestations of the Green speak in this halting manner.
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Post by redsycorax on Nov 14, 2023 22:23:07 GMT
Which would seem to suggest, as Doc says, that this is indeed the salience of the difficulty of forming analogues to the vocal chords, diaphragm and human tongue and possibly simulating areas of the human brain that govern speech. Perhaps elementals lack particular biochemicals that assist in the formation of relevant anatomy that is involved in human vocalisation and cannot readily access such essential substances.
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Post by dans on Nov 14, 2023 22:45:27 GMT
or maybe their vocal cords are made of wood? They may actually form words by changing the size of a resonator chamber, which takes longer to do with muscle fibres that are made of vegetation, and so they have to speak more slowly? And perhaps their voices are more on the bass end of the range?
Personally I would still rather read their words without a bunch of ellipses to show that they are speaking slowly, and instead have the author remind us periodically that the speaker is talking slowly in very deep tones. But this is only a personal preference - I can see Doc's point, too, of writing the dialog and then inserting ellipses afterwards, so the reader gets a constant reminder.
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Post by redsycorax on Nov 15, 2023 1:54:35 GMT
For whatever reason, it adds to character depth to consider what variant anatomies might be involved in this context. One wonders if animal form elementals might be able to vocalise with greater ease, particularly if they're cetacean, primate or avian-bodied?
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Post by dans on Nov 16, 2023 12:14:09 GMT
I find that knowing details like this during writing are very important to me, even if they never make it into the story. I think eventually it adds realism to the depiction and actions of characters
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